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shakey hillclimb/race footage · by **patrick** » 16 Feb 2011, 06:15

P_Friesacher wrote:I'm not sure it's that easy: Team only go to tests with one car rather than two. There are far less track marshals at tracks for testing - additional personell would have to be there. The same goes for timing, scoring and TV equipment. A lot of race relevant-equipment has been sent to Bahrain weeks ago by ship. And a track would also need a few weeks to prepare at least for the number of people an F1 race would need to turn a profit.

valid points. I suppose the GP2 Asia race there this weekend will be a sort-of guinea pig for the following weeks. Things could have died down by the time F1 is in town, although the protesters seem to be well aware there is much to be gained from the race.

by **mario** » 16 Feb 2011, 09:31

Aerond wrote:
patrick wrote:in light of this situation, does anyone know, and would like to list, the circuits suitable for F1 (as deemed by the FIA) that are not currently on the calendar?

I don´t think it would be substitued with another GP, but tracks I can quickly think of include Magny Course, Hockenheim, Imola, Fuji...

Off the top of my head, the tracks which definitely hold a FIA Grade 1 licence (i.e. can hold an F1 event), and are not already holding a race in 2011 are Fuji, Hockenheim and Mangy Cours. Searching further, and going back to a very old post that I'd put up a long time ago when the question of circuit grades came up, there aren't that many more circuits which are eligible.

Code: Select all: GRADE 2 CIRCUIT NAME COUNTRY GRADE LENGTH LICENCE EXPIRES Albacete E 2 3.539 5.5.10 Anderstorp S 2 4.025 9.5.11 Assen National Circuit NL 2 4.555 14.4.12 Autopolis J 2 4.674 16.3.12 Bahrain Endurance BH 2 6.299 8.6.09 Bahrain Oasis Circuit BH 2 2.554 1.4.10 Bahrain Outer Circuit BH 2 3.543 1.4.10 Barber Motorsports Park USA 2 3.808 3.5.10 Brno CZ 2 5.403 2.4.10 Bucharest RO 2 3.105 22.7.09 Catalunya Short Circuit E 2 2.977 15.4.10 Cleveland- Burke Lakefront Airport USA 2 21.6.10 Daytona USA 2 4.720 7.2.10 Denver USA 2 2.680 10.8.09 Detroit Belle Isle USA 2 3.380 23.8.10 Dijon-Prenois F 2 3.800 21.4.11 Durban ZA 2 3.300 22.2.11 Edmonton City Centre Raceway CDN 2 3.106 23.7.11 Eurospeedway Lausitz DTM-Strecke D 2 3.478 9.4.10 Eurospeedway Lausitz Oval D 2 3.176 9.4.10 Goldenport Chengdu CN 2 3.331 1.5.11 Hockenheim Special D 2 2.604 26.7.11 Homestead USA 2 3.701 8.2.10 Houston City USA 2 2.668 18.4.10 Infineon Raceway-Sears Point USA 2 3.600 1.6.09 Iowa Speedway-Road Course USA 2 2.080 1.5.10 Jarama E 2 3.850 5.11.10 Kyalami ZA 2 4.263 20.11.11 Laguna Seca Raceway USA 2 3.581 6.3.12 LasVegas USA 2 3.927 5.4.10 LeMans 24 Heures F 2 13.629 29.5.10 LeMans Bugatti F 2 4.185 11.6.11 Lime Rock USA 2 2.448 13.6.09 Long Beach USA 2 3.168 12.4.10 Mexico City-ForoSol MEX 2 4.472 17.1.11 Mid-Ohio USA 2 3.600 5.12.09 Miller Motorsports Park USA 2 7.224 2.6.09 Misano Adriatico-Long Track I 2 4.226 26.3.11 Mont Tremblant CDN 2 4.218 21.6.10 Most CZ 2 4.219 23.4.11 Norisring D 2 2.300 21.6.10 Nürburgring-Nordschliefe D 2 4.638 31.1.10 Okayama J 2 3.703 15.3.12 Oschersleben Motorsport Arena D 2 3.696 11.3.10 Portland USA 2 3.150 3.6.09 Qatar-Losail QA 2 5.380 11.4.09 Road America–Elkhart Lake USA 2 6.477 1.5.10 Road Atlanta USA 2 4.090 26.9.10 Sachsenring D 2 3.645 20.8.11 San José USA 2 2.322 17.8.09 Sebring USA 2 5.970 13.3.12 Sepang North Circuit MAL 2 2.807 26.4.10 Shanghai International Track CN 2 4.603 3.6.10 St.Petersburg USA 2 2.910 25.3.10 Sugo J 2 3.704 27.5.11 Surfers Paradise Queensland AUS 2 4.470 24.10.11 Suzuka East Course J 2 2.243 31.1.10 Taupo NZ 2 3.321 30.7.10 Tokachi J 2 5.091 28.5.11 Tokachi Short Layout J 2 3.405 28.5.11 Toronto Lakeshore Circuit CDN 2 2.870 6.7.10 Twin Ring Motegi Grand Prix J 2 4.801 9.5.09 Twin Ring Motegi Oval J 2 2.492 9.5.09 Umbria-Magione I 2 2.505 14.4.09 Virginia Int.Raceway-Alton USA 2 5.248 2.5.10 Watkins Glen USA 2 5.552 4.5.10 Zhuhai CN 2 4.318 20.3.10 Zolder B 2 4.000 11.4.09 And here are the Category 2 circuits where Formula 1 cars are allowed to carry out tests. Grade 1T and 2 Adria I 2+1T 2.702 19.4.09 Algarve P 2+1T 4.684 27.3.12 Dubai International Circuit UAE 2+1T 4.290 8.10.10 Estoril P 2+1T 4.182 1.1.10 Eurospeedway Lausitz Grand Prix D 2+1T 4.567 9.4.10 Jerez E 2+1T 4.428 8.9.11 Misano Adriatico I 2+1T 4.048 26.3.11 Monteblanco E 2+1T 4.432 9.12.11 Nogaro F 2+1T 3.636 21.2.10 Vallelunga International I 2+1T 4.085 27.10.11 Vallelunga Junior I 2+1T 3.228 27.10.11 Zandvoort NL 2+1T 4.307 30.5.11 GRADE 1 Albert Park AUS 1 5.303 31.1.10 Bahrain BH 1 5.412 1.4.10 Bahrain Paddock Circuit BH 1 3.823 1.4.10 Catalunya E 1 4.655 13.2.10 Dubai Grand Prix Circuit UAE 1 5.390 8.10.10 Fuji Speedway J 1 4.563 12.1.11 Fuji Speedway-Short Layout J 1 4.526 12.1.11 Hockenheim Grand Prix D 1 4.574 26.7.11 Hungaroring H 1 4.381 16.7.09 Imola I 1 4.909 3.9.11 Indianapolis Grand Prix USA 1 4.192 4.9.09 Interlagos BR 1 4.309 31.1.10 Istanbul Park TR 1 5.338 11.5.11 Magny-Cours F 1 4.411 28.4.09 Monaco MC 1 3.340 23.5.10 Montreal Gilles Villeneuve CDN 1 4.361 19.4.11 Monza I 1 5.793 31.1.10 Mugello I 1 5.245 8.5.10 Nürburgring Grand Prix D 1 5.148 31.1.10 Sepang MAL 1 5.543 1.10.11 Shanghai International CN 1 5.451 3.6.10 Silverstone Grand Prix GB 1 5.141 5.7.10 Spa-Francorchamps B 1 7.004 31.5.10 Suzuka J 1 5.807 31.1.10 Valencia (Urban) E 1 5.419 21.8.09 Grade 1T PaulRicard F 1T 5.842 26.7.09

So, Imola would be another possibility, since it holds the appropriate licence. Jerez, Algarve, Paul Ricard and Estoril all currently hold 1T licences, which allows them to hold test sessions only at the moment.
Now, out of those, Paul Ricard, I believe, has next to no spectator or press facilities (because it mainly functions as a test track); in addition, the Le Mans Series normally carries out official test sessions in early March, which would probably clash with an F1 race (although, with Bernie owning Paul Ricard, I imagine that the F1 race would get precedence). A long haul event like Fuji would be very unlikely (even more so now Toyota has left - and, moreover, Toyota would probably be unhappy about having to subsidise the event), Mangy Cours would probably be hit by the age old problem of its poor supporting infrastructure and funding, and having held the race in 2010, I doubt that the owners of Hockenheim could afford to hold the race again in 2011.

So, my hypothetical suggestion would be that, if it came down to it, the most likely choices would either be Estoril or Jerez. At the very least, if things are still unstable in Bahrain for the last test, I guess that Jerez or Esoril would be the fall back for testing simply because the teams already have experience with holding tests at those circuits, and would probably tend to go for a familiar setting over the unknown qualities of Algarve.

In reality, though, as P_Friesacher points out, picking a track is probably the easiest part - equipping the track to cope with the influx of media personnel, the teams staff, fans etc. would be a major issue, especially at such short notice. I would therefore assume that, unless the situation deteriorates rapidly over the next few weeks, Bernie is more likely to press on with the race and gamble that the protesters will back down. After all, I believe that some activists have threatened to protest during the race in the past, but there was no action; so, Bernie might call their bluff and see if they call off the protests.
If, on the other hand, things do get worse (as they may), Bernie would probably cite "force majeure" and cancel the race, with the season starting in Australia instead. The teams might grumble a bit, but they'd probably accept the decision, and overall I imagine that few would consider Bernie as acting unreasonably if he cancelled the race in the face of widespread strike action.

by **eagleash** » 17 Feb 2011, 03:51

We've been through all this before, quite recently, when there was doubt over Korea. If Bahrain has to be cancelled the season will in all probability start in Australia. It takes several months (if not years) to properly prepare for a GP & any substitute race is likely to be later in the season, although it is difficult to see where it could be fitted in, if there is to be a break. The European Summer schedule is already pretty crowded & the teams may not welcome another long haul or flyaway race.
Magny Cours has recently become more accessible I understand with the opening of a new stretch of Motorway. There being currently no French GP, maybe one could be slotted in there somehow. Closer to home for all the teams.

by **TimmyB** » 17 Feb 2011, 17:33

Hmm... all of this is steadily increasing the value of my 4 day grandstand ticket for Melbourne.

Not that I'm planning on selling it of course!

by **DanielPT** » 17 Feb 2011, 20:35

Just like last year with Korea, Bernie is just avoiding any decisions until the latest moment possible. In the face of these protests and several manifestations that should exist in the next several days the best decision right now is to change the previously scheduled testing sessions from Bahrain to elsewhere. For the race, we shall see how things evolve. Nonetheless Bernie is probably negotiating either changing the race or postpone it. Just in case.

Since Bernie is at the helm, Formula 1 didn't had problems of any sort of postponing or cancelling an event (if I am not mistaken). Except that 2005 US GP debacle, which was not his fault and the "race" took place anyway. I am confident that this situation is going to be correctly handled by Bernie.

By the way, the GP2 Asia practice and first qualifying were cancelled. Tomorrow a practice/qualifying session will take place in the morning and the race in the afternoon. The only reason that prevented today's events were absence of medical staff at the track. They stayed in prevention at a hospital on Manama.

by **JQW** » 17 Feb 2011, 21:11

Today's GP2 Asia practice session in Bahrain has been cancelled due to a lack of medical cover:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsp ... 400392.stm

by **Ed24** » 17 Feb 2011, 21:55

P_Friesacher wrote:Careful, though, about the news of Saudi troops on their way to Bahrain. As of now that has only been reported by Iranian news agancies - who might have interest in destabilizing Bahrain as well as Saudi Arabia.

Yes, that's true, although it seems they are there now.

In fact a NYTimes journo is reporting on Twitter that a "ambulance driver told me #Saudi army officer held gun to his head, said wld kill him if helped injured". http://twitter.com/NickKristof

I just hope F1 sees reason and takes action, it would be a disgrace if everyone turned up as normal when the government is slaughtering its own people. Now Reuters is reporting that "opposition MP says about 60 people missing after police storm protest camp " http://twitter.com/Reuters

Bas Leinders has said on Twitter that the race should be moved to Magny-Cours. While it would be great to have France on the calendar, I don't think it could be organised in such a short time period. In particular, it would be hard to find marshalls, officials etc. as well as the infrastructure for hotels and accomodation. I think the best option is to postpone the Bahrain race until later in the year (provisionally), and just go straight to Melbourne.

by **Jeroen Krautmeir** » 17 Feb 2011, 22:09

Apparently the GP2 race has been cancelled. Not good...

by **Ed24** » 17 Feb 2011, 22:17

What's interesting is that it was the government (through the Bahrain Motorsport Federation) that cancelled it.

Obviously F1 is more important to them than GP2, but at least they are willing to see reason and cancel the event.

Autosport says that there is a teams meeting tomorrow, so I'm sure that at least the fate of the Bahrain test will be determined then.

by **Paul Hayes** » 17 Feb 2011, 22:21

Is Jerez doing anything on the weekend of the 13th...?

(Obviously not a serious suggestion, by the way. Clearly if Bahrain goes, we'll have a 19-race season).

by **Ed24** » 17 Feb 2011, 22:27

Paul Hayes wrote:Is Jerez doing anything on the weekend of the 13th...?

(Obviously not a serious suggestion, by the way. Clearly if Bahrain goes, we'll have a 19-race season).

Bahrain could still run before/after Abu Dhabi late in the year, but who knows, it might be a whole new government then.

by **dinizintheoven** » 17 Feb 2011, 22:38

With all this talk of postponement and "will it work", I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the 1995 Pacific Grand Prix - moved from April to October after the Earth decided to rid itself of nearby Kobe. It created a few problems, moving the race, but it went ahead anyway.

by **JQW** » 17 Feb 2011, 22:53

dinizintheoven wrote:With all this talk of postponement and "will it work", I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the 1995 Pacific Grand Prix - moved from April to October after the Earth decided to rid itself of nearby Kobe. It created a few problems, moving the race, but it went ahead anyway.

Then there was the 1985 Belgian Grand Prix which was rescheduled to later in the year after the newly laid track started to break up.

by **TimmyB** » 17 Feb 2011, 22:55

Every decade that passes makes it harder to change the timing of an F1 event.

For example, Fuji 07(?) and Indy 05 were races that still went ahead 'in a way' which probably would have been called off 2 or 3 decades ago.

Despite this, 50 bucks says Bahrain's not happening this year.

by **watka** » 17 Feb 2011, 23:27

With any luck, all of this will be a good excuse to strike Bahrain off of the calendar permanently...

shakey hillclimb/race footage · by **patrick** » 17 Feb 2011, 23:29

This is a terrible situation, I have friends in bahrain - native, not expat - and I am fearful for their safety.
Surprisingly, the F1 journos that are already there for the GP2 race have put out some great pieces compared to the mainstream media - which I suppose is thanks to them visiting the country every year.
http://willthef1journo.wordpress.com/20 ... e-bahrain/
It goes without saying that the race should be canceled. The arabs may have money for bernie but F1 needs to stay away from global politics.

Interestingly, an American friend of mine theorized that a back-up race held in America would sell out or at the least have a good turnout - even at such short notice. How practical this is remains to be seen - mario's list shows only Indianapolis holds an (expired) F1-grade license and as many people have pointed out a lot of F1 equipment is in Bahrain. If this situation had arisen earlier though, it might have been quite a scoop.

by **Ed24** » 17 Feb 2011, 23:51

I'm sure a third Spanish race would be 100% full, or a race in Portugal or France would also get good crowds, but I don't know if it's logistically possible.

Abu Dhabi seems like the only other option, for the test and the race. However, the teams might decide that going to the Middle East might not be the best idea, I mean it's not impossible that protests will spread to the UAE.

by **Pieman** » 18 Feb 2011, 01:05

Ed24 wrote:I'm sure a third Spanish race would be 100% full, or a race in Portugal or France would also get good crowds, but I don't know if it's logistically possible.

Abu Dhabi seems like the only other option, for the test and the race. However, the teams might decide that going to the Middle East might not be the best idea, I mean it's not impossible that protests will spread to the UAE.

If they are going to add a race on at the end of the season, a Portuguese GP at the new Algarve circuit would be nice - what FIA grade does this hold?

(Even better would be an Argentine GP at that new circuit the GT1 World Championship debuted at last year, run the week after Brazil, but that won't happen.)

by **mario** » 18 Feb 2011, 01:15

patrick wrote:This is a terrible situation, I have friends in bahrain - native, not expat - and I am fearful for their safety.
Surprisingly, the F1 journos that are already there for the GP2 race have put out some great pieces compared to the mainstream media - which I suppose is thanks to them visiting the country every year.
http://willthef1journo.wordpress.com/20 ... e-bahrain/
It goes without saying that the race should be canceled. The arabs may have money for bernie but F1 needs to stay away from global politics.

Interestingly, an American friend of mine theorized that a back-up race held in America would sell out or at the least have a good turnout - even at such short notice. How practical this is remains to be seen - mario's list shows only Indianapolis holds an (expired) F1-grade license and as many people have pointed out a lot of F1 equipment is in Bahrain. If this situation had arisen earlier though, it might have been quite a scoop.

Judging by the fact that the Bahraini Government has now effectively ordered the military to take control of most of the city, and the violence they have authorised to break up the protest camps, you have every right to be worried. Even more so when BBC reports indicate that, judging by the injuries of those in hospital, the riot police were using live ammunition, and took the attitude of firing first and asking questions later. Then, on top of that, it seems that outside journalists have been targeted too, with a member of the ABC News network begin targeted by riot police and beaten, seemingly for reporting on what was going on in Pearl Square as the riot police moved in.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12495733

As for what might happen to the race, which now seems to be a bit of a hollow question, well, you have to assume that relocating the race would be difficult at short notice. It's come up a number of times on different sites, and the main question is this: how could they do it? John Booth has said that most of the teams dispatched their equipment by cargo ship to Bahrain some time ago; relocating that amount of equipment now would be, he says, impractical. I imagine that would be an even greater problem if somebody tried to hold a long haul event (say, like a round in the US).
http://en.espnf1.com/bahrain/motorsport ... 41087.html

Pieman wrote:
Ed24 wrote:I'm sure a third Spanish race would be 100% full, or a race in Portugal or France would also get good crowds, but I don't know if it's logistically possible.

Abu Dhabi seems like the only other option, for the test and the race. However, the teams might decide that going to the Middle East might not be the best idea, I mean it's not impossible that protests will spread to the UAE.

If they are going to add a race on at the end of the season, a Portuguese GP at the new Algarve circuit would be nice - what FIA grade does this hold?

(Even better would be an Argentine GP at that new circuit the GT1 World Championship debuted at last year, run the week after Brazil, but that won't happen.)

Algarve currently has a Grade 1T licence; it can currently hold a test session, but not a race as things stand. However, the track was, I believe, designed with the possibility of a race in mind, so in theory I would assume that they could obtain a full Grade 1 licence if required (but, as I've said before, it's more likely that they'll just cancel the race instead of scrambling to find a new venue).
As for Potrero De Los Funes, that venue has a Grade 2 licence, allowing it to hold GT races but no F1 events (either testing or a race); my understanding is that the crash protection zones are not adequate for F1 cars, and it'd probably be far too expensive to bring the venue to to scratch for an F1 event.

by **theshoo** » 18 Feb 2011, 01:45

The GP2 Asia Series race in Bahrain has been canceled amid anti-government protests that have left four dead overnight — less than a month before the season-opening Formula One race at the same circuit. - Associated Press

Looking even more doubtful for March 13 now.

by **F1000X** » 18 Feb 2011, 02:08

Moving Abu Dhabi to the front of the Calendar and adding a race at the end, not a bad idea.

by **ADx_Wales** » 18 Feb 2011, 02:29

The Algarve's basic facilities for a massive race attendance would not be good enough for an F1 race, its been said a few times during the LMS 1000km races over the internet radio broadcast that its not good enough, despite the layout being "F1 Standard" however not "F1 Awesome", despite the hills it still reeks of typical Mediterranian layout.

Moving Abu Dhabi to round 1, yes that being the nearest, but did we not want to go there anyway?
Doha isnt far, but is still set up for bike races only, having seen the GP Masters race.
Dubai has a good layout, but again the facilities come into question including official F1 theme park.
Somehow Imola still has its Grade 1 license despite evidence via the two massive shunts in consecutive Auto GP and GT Open races that were held there in early summer.

Should it not happen, at all, technically Melbourne is round 1 again, so its not all bad*.

by **CarlosFerreira** » 18 Feb 2011, 03:13

Jeroen Krautmeir wrote:Apparently the GP2 race has been cancelled. Not good...

Correct. Plus, as someone mentioned above, the protesters are openly targeting the F1 race because of the media coverage it attracts. As an example, F1, GP2 and GP3 journo Will Buxton produced a piece for Al-Jazeera and another for BBC 5 Live today.

Similar stunts have been played in the past. The situation or motives of the people behind the scenes is entirely different of course, but Al-Qaeda in the Arabia Peninsula got the Dakar canceled in 2008. I imagine FOM has insured the venue against cancellation (which is a typical business behaviour in this sort of event), but it'd still hurt F1 (and Bernie's) reputation.

Mind you, it would not be catastrophic. F1 has bounced back from moments such as Imola 1994 (tragedy) or US 2005 (comedy), I'm sure missing out Bahrain 2011 would simply make a number of people significantly less wealthy.

by **Yannick** » 18 Feb 2011, 06:24

If the GP in Bahrain would go ahead despite ongoing protests, could you imagine protesters running onto the track during the race - like the former Mercedes employee did a few years back at the Old Hockenheimring and like that religious fanatic did a few years back at Silverstone?

In short - wouldn't it be nice if Rubens Barrichello would win another race?

OK, now we've had a little fun, but it's a fact that given the violence the government recently used their against their own populace, it would not be wise for a foreigner with expensive equipment to go there.

by **Collieafc** » 18 Feb 2011, 06:36

If they have to have a 20 race calander, then why not just make the first race wherever they are holding the testing? (e.g Jerez) Then at least they have some of the stuff there already, plus there wont be as much of a logistics headache

Though if somebody said no, and its a 19 race calandar, as much as I would whine about having to wait longer for the F1, realistically it would make sense

by **JeremyMcClean** » 19 Feb 2011, 03:37

Jerez is a good idea, but it's a better late in the season than having it at the beginning.

by **Henrique** » 19 Feb 2011, 04:25

A Portuguese news channel talked to Tiago Monteiro (yes, The Tiago Monteiro) about the GP2 race, since he's director of Ocean. He said that there were no cabs at the airport, so they took two hours to get to the hotel, instead of 15 minutes. Some teams that were on other hotels downtown actually heard gunshots. He also mentioned that the first practice didn't happen because there were no doctors available and that there were many soldiers on the streets between his hotel and the airport, on the way back.

Website · by **Wizzie** » 19 Feb 2011, 12:30

I've just found out through Adam Cooper that the Bahraini Government owns something like 42% of the McLaren team... now take a guess as to who is the head of FOTA?

Hopefully it won't make a difference to the fate of the GP (which I personally believe should be cancelled) but it does make for a good trivia night question.

by **thehemogoblin** » 19 Feb 2011, 13:24

Wizzie wrote:I've just found out through Adam Cooper that the Bahraini Government owns something like 42% of the McLaren team... now take a guess as to who is the head of FOTA?

Hopefully it won't make a difference to the fate of the GP (which I personally believe should be cancelled) but it does make for a good trivia night question.

Well, that certainly throws an interesting dynamic into this whole situation.

by **ADx_Wales** » 19 Feb 2011, 19:09

So not only is the GP screwed but potentially McLaren could be screwed Royally?

If F1 was a country we'd all be on the streets wanting Bernie to leave.

by **fjackdaw** » 19 Feb 2011, 19:14

I never like anything to get in the way of my Grand Prix weekend normally, but I think it should be called off. If nothing else, it's not good for F1's image to endorse a government which is the subject of a popular uprising.

by **Ferrim** » 19 Feb 2011, 20:24

I am even considering not following the race at all if it happens. And it should be a good moment for us to think in the implications of this. It may have gone very public and to the extreme, but Bahrain's record on human rights is poor, as is the UAE's and China's, which are the kind of regimes under which something like this could happen. It's a bit of a hipocrisy to support these governments (I'm the first one who has watched every Bahrain GP to date) and then get surprised when they treat their own people like this.

Does anyone know a working e-mail direction of the FOM? I know Bernie doesn't care about what I think, but I'm thinking of sending an e-mail with my thoughts.

by **Glennerz** » 19 Feb 2011, 22:36

I just have a bad feeling at the moment that if the race goes ahead, the outcome will be remembered as farcical or tragic.

by **Jeroen Krautmeir** » 19 Feb 2011, 22:50

Glennerz wrote:I just have a bad feeling at the moment that if the race goes ahead, the outcome will be remembered as farcical or tragic.

Agreed

by **Ferrim** » 19 Feb 2011, 22:53

Glennerz wrote:I just have a bad feeling at the moment that if the race goes ahead, the outcome will be remembered as farcical or tragic.

That's for sure. If nothing bad happens it will be farcical.

by **Myrvold** » 19 Feb 2011, 22:55

Protests on track, military shooting people that protest...

shakey hillclimb/race footage · by **patrick** » 19 Feb 2011, 23:28

In the last 24 hours a string of travel departments for various countries have warned against going to Bahrain (for example, the foreign office). I just can't see how the race can happen now.
This surely invalidates a lot of insurance policies involved with the teams and drivers, sponsors won't want to be seen there and the families of journos, teams and drivers won't want them there. Let's just hope bernie accepts this and nothing stupid happens

by **CarlosFerreira** » 20 Feb 2011, 00:24

patrick wrote:In the last 24 hours a string of travel departments for various countries have warned against going to Bahrain (for example, the foreign office). I just can't see how the race can happen now.
This surely invalidates a lot of insurance policies involved with the teams and drivers, sponsors won't want to be seen there and the families of journos, teams and drivers won't want them there. Let's just hope bernie accepts this and nothing stupid happens

Insurance really is a big deal in this issue - Will Buxton just mentioned the same fact. If the advise is maintained, that means no insurance and no race.

by **fjackdaw** » 20 Feb 2011, 00:30

Ferrim wrote:I am even considering not following the race at all if it happens. And it should be a good moment for us to think in the implications of this. It may have gone very public and to the extreme, but Bahrain's record on human rights is poor, as is the UAE's and China's, which are the kind of regimes under which something like this could happen. It's a bit of a hipocrisy to support these governments (I'm the first one who has watched every Bahrain GP to date) and then get surprised when they treat their own people like this.

Yes, I'm still uncomfortable about there being a Chinese GP at all. The Chinese execute more of their own people than all other nations put together, many times over. Usually on trumped-up charges, or minor crimes like prostitution or petty fraud (an entire government department, made up solely of women, was recently executed for minor fraud). They'll usually harvest the organs, quite often when the victim isn't properly dead; and, most ghastly of all, by-products of Chinese execution victims have been known to be used in cosmetic products sold to the west. Most executions are carried out immediately after the trial, so there's no opportunity for an appeal.

by **CarlosFerreira** » 20 Feb 2011, 00:35

fjackdaw wrote:
Ferrim wrote:I am even considering not following the race at all if it happens. And it should be a good moment for us to think in the implications of this. It may have gone very public and to the extreme, but Bahrain's record on human rights is poor, as is the UAE's and China's, which are the kind of regimes under which something like this could happen. It's a bit of a hipocrisy to support these governments (I'm the first one who has watched every Bahrain GP to date) and then get surprised when they treat their own people like this.

Yes, I'm still uncomfortable about there being a Chinese GP at all. The Chinese execute more of their own people than all other nations put together, many times over. Usually on trumped-up charges, or minor crimes like prostitution or petty fraud (an entire government department, made up solely of women, was recently executed for minor fraud). They'll usually harvest the organs, quite often when the victim isn't properly dead; and, most ghastly of all, by-products of Chinese execution victims have been known to be used in cosmetic products sold to the west. Most executions are carried out immediately after the trial, so there's no opportunity for an appeal.

Huh, chaps... let's leave at that, OK? :shock:

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